Would Celtic & Rangers make it in the English Premiership?

Its a topic that has been thought about for several years now but with the onset of multi billionaire chairman invading the English Premiership then Celtic & Rangers must be looking across the border with envious eyes.
While the likes of teams like Bolton splashing over £8 mil on a single player while the Glasgow big two spent pennies in comparision. A move to the Premiership would surely attract the eyes of billionaires as the fanbase for the two clubs is global already so they would quickly be able to compete financally.
I'd see them join, be mid table for a few years and then compete with the big four (five if City take off) for the top spots. The Scottish league though would die a very painful death without them and the other clubs would have to follow (Hearts, Hibs, Aberdeen, Motherwell) What remained would end up similar to the Welsh league.

I think if they came South the only way they would make it is if they had huge investment.

Both clubs would be very attractive proposistions as they have massive fan base and a huge amount of potential I think they could make a an impact but need investment

theyd get a massive shed of cash for joining the league anyway, so yes they would be 3rd 4th contenders right away

I'd agree with your assessment macclads, both sides would probably achieve a midtable finish in their first season, as they do have reasonable sides, and with the addition of the sky money, could bring in a couple of top quality players. After that who knows, but the potential would certainly be there for them to make a push for the top 4, but in order to do that then they would definitely need one of these billionaire investors.

CruiserJim wrote:

I think if they came South the only way they would make it is if they had huge investment.

Both clubs would be very attractive proposistions as they have massive fan base and a huge amount of potential I think they could make a an impact but need investment

Right. It'll depend on the Sheik or russian, who comes with them..

The Scottish Premiership is obviously holding back the potential of the Glasgow big two.
No-one is going to invest in the clubs while they are stuck in such a poor league but the Scottish FA will be trying to cling onto them as without them the entire infrastructure of the leagues collapses.
The other stumbling block is for those two to join the English Premiership then two other clubs have to be booted down to the Championship. Those clubs aint going to be happy with that. How I'd see it possibly happening is that if Celtic/Rangers wish to join then they would have to enter at Championship level. The two clubs that drop from there to League One are given a cash incentive from the Glasgow clubs to keep them sweet (the likes of clubs like Barnsley, Norwich and Doncaster would happily take £20 mil for a drop I reckon). This then lets Celtic/Rangers get acclimatized to the English game and make their inevitable march into the Premiership the following year.

A few years ago the Old Firm even proposed starting in the third division and working their way up, but that was vetoed by the English league, so unfortunately I can't really see it happening. FIFA don't want it to happen either as they say a team from one country can't play in anothers league, but what about Cardiff?

The biggest stumbling block would be the other SPL teams though. While they would probably be happy that they'd have a chance of winning the league if we left, it is likely that Setanta wouldn't bother with TV coverage anymore, leaving the league in utter disarray

Rangers and Celtic should not be allowed to join the English league, simple as that. If they did, it should be at the bottom, and they should be made to make their way up, like Gretna had to when they joined the Scottish League.

Maccs, I see where you're coming from with the suggestion that they join the Championship and Doncaster and co get a sweetener to give them a place, but doesn't that make a mockery of the entire league system if someone can 'buy' their club a place in any division they want?

Fans of the clubs that drop down a league would go nuts too, although they got relegated pretty quickly, Barnsley fans still go on about their one Premiership season now. As a fan, wouldn't you rather have the one season playing Man Yoo and co, and make a shed load of money, than have money and trips to Walsall and oldham to look forward to?

if they started in english leagues then it would have to be way bellow the conferance, not bloody third division!


and it should never happen as were now way past the voting of teams in etc, if theyd have thought of it a hundred years ago then it wouldnt matter, but they didnt so fuck them.

Cardiff and swansea had the right idea. saw potential of having only 2 clubs from an entire country in a more stable league base.

The Scottish league would fall apart without them. The lesser big clubs like Hearts, Hibs, Motherwell would all want to jump over and they'd have to come in at a lower level (League 1?) The rest would all end up conference level at best.
The English clubs have vetoed it previously but money is more the deciding factor. having the glamour of the big two playing you and the income could sweeten the deal.
Although it has been blocked previously I think it's an inevitable event as Celtic/Rangers will end up walking out on the Scottish league sooner rather than later.

With regards to Grecians comments about the likes of Doncaster fans etc not being happy with it, sure a huge amount won't be, but they'll quickly realise the long term benefits of a huge cash injection outnumber the short term drop.

If this were to happen, it would no more be the English Premier League, everything would have to change, the name for starters would become Brittish Premier League rather than the English. Thats obv not the problem, how would you fit them in?

I think the only answer would be to make the prem a 22 team league for the one off season, have the bottom three relagated as standard, have the top 2 teams promoted from the champ to replace the relagated 3, that still leaves you with 21 teams in the prem, instead of the playoff place with the (im not sure how many, is it 4?) teams, you have the teams from the prem which finished in 17th and 16th join that playoff position.

So it would be

Prem:


16th team A - playoff
17th team B - playoff
18th team C - relegated
19th team D - relegated
20th team E - relegated

Championship

1st team 1 - promotion
2nd team 2 - promotion
3rd team 3 - playoff
4th team 4 - playoff
5th team 5 - playoff
6th team 6 - playoff

this would leave 6 teams in the playoff

5 would be in Championship and one to make the Prem the following season

for example
Team A v Team B-------------Team A

Team 3 v Team 4-------------Team 3

Team 5 v Team 6-------------Team 5

This would create a mini league between the 3 teams, they all play eachother once, whoever wins by points/goal difference will be promoted, or stay in the prem, alternitavley, you would have all 6 teams in a mini league, with the team who finish top staying or mgetting the promotion to the prem.

All seems very confusing as i write it, but it would seem like the best way to do it.

For the record id rather it not to happen lol

IMO No. A few years ago they were on about actually moving them to the championship but those talks have disappeared.

no disrespect to any of our scottish friends on here but i don't want them to come down south, look what happened in manchester for the uefa cup final a few months back with the rangers fans going mental, that could happen every week as they'd come down on mass tearin shit up.

C4lum wrote:

If this were to happen, it would no more be the English Premier League, everything would have to change, the name for starters would become Brittish Premier League rather than the English. Thats obv not the problem, how would you fit them in?

You see I think that would be the problem, not the name change itself, but the fact that it would actually become the "British premier league", that would give Fifa the ammo they are looking for in terms of us competing as separate nations on the international stage.

That's also a reason we won't have a mixed team at London 2012.

Its a nice idea, but I would put every penny I have on it never EVER happening.

Does anyone know when, why and how Swansea and Cardiff ended up in the English leagues?

probably voted in by whoever after putting their case forward and having backing etc.

started in the southwest 2nd division or some arse

I personally wouldn't want to move, while it would appear logical to move and get involved with the cash cow in the EPL I just think clubs should remain loyal to there roots, I seriously believe that whats going on down in England just now with more and more foreign owners is killing football as we know it, the money for dud players is ridiculous, Celtic can not afford to spend £6m on a player but someone like Bobby Zamora can be sold for £6.5m!

Celtic have the second highest grossing income from oversees sales in merchandise in the United Kingdom, Only Manchester United can better that.

Tuesdays game at Old Trafford has not scared me, I want to see my club play the best teams, however I don't want to sell my sole to see that, for me the only way to see Celtic play the best teams is for the club to be run well enough not to bankrupt us and allow us to buy players who will help us win the league and enter the champions League and in doing so play these teams, the way forward for Celtic is to take the Arsene Wenger approach and make sure we get the best pick of the younger players and coach them to a level where making trips to Old Trafford will not be as daunting, and of course landing the odd player with Henrik Larssons ability every now and again always helps.

I am positive Rupert Murdoch and his advisers would relish Celtic and Rangers in the EPL, for a start you wouldn't see so many half empty stadiums, they would be packed out, however EPL clubs don't want us and who could blame them, why vote in a club who could potentially take there place, we up here in Scotland use the old 'money factor' as an easy get out when talking about reasons we cannot compete however teams like Bordeaux, Ajax, PSV, Rosenborg and Werder Bremen manage to make a fist of it year in year out, without the SKY dollar.

For the price of a season ticket at Celtic Park compared to that at Bayern Munich and Barcelona as well as the San Siro then Celtic do make ridiculous amounts of cash per year, only they fleece the fans instead of taking from a sugar daddy or a league generated cashpoint!

I say leave the EPL dream for the teams who have fought tooth and nail for decades trying to be the next Wimbledon, that is there destiny, Celtic as well as Rangers belong in Scotland, its where we were formed and its where we belong