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| | Undertaker at Wrestlemania | |
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+5hodge13 Sexton Hardcastle Perfect Jack Worthy Mackem 9 posters | Author | Message |
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Mackem Most decorated Champion in history
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Location : Sunderland, England Number of posts : 7076 Favourite Wrestler : John Cena, Stone Cold Steve Austin, CM Punk, AJ Styles & The Boogyman
| Subject: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:08 pm | |
| Below is all of Undertakers Wrestlemania opponents. The point of this discussing is how many of his opponents were the top guys in the WWF / WWE at the time? The streak will, and rightly so, go down in history but with Wrestlemania being the grandest stage of them all, why was The Undertaker kept away from the title and / or the top guys mant times? Below is my thought on his matches.
Wrestlemania 7 Superfly Jimmy Snooker His 1st Wrestlemania.
Wrestlemania 8 Jake the Snake Roberts- Hulk Hogan was in the main event and it wasnt a title match. Around the end of 1991, Hogan and Taker were fueding over the title. They could of continued this till mania.
Wrestlemania 9 Giant Gonzalez Hulk Hogan returned and won the title when he wasnt in the main event. Wrestlemania 11 King Kong Bundy Million Dollar Corperation was at large around this time. Undertaker wanted his urn back. Bundy was there biggest guy in the Corperation. HBK and Deisel main evented.
Wrestlemania 12 Diesel the birth of shawn michaels as a main eventer and diesel cost Undertaker the title a few times.
Wrestlemania 13 Sycho Sid Stone cold and Bret Hart were the two biggest stars at this time. It seems to me that sycho sid was the easy option to keep the streak alive.
Wrestlemania 14 Kane 1st fued with brother over 5 months so it needed a wrestlemania finish to it
Wrestlemania 15 Big Bossman Ministry of darkness leader against vinces top dog. The Rock was in the Corperation at this time. Id thought the ministry would go after the big prize - WWF title
Wrestlemania 17 HHH seemed to be thrown together. Austin and The Rock again main event.
Wrestlemania 18 Ric Flair In my opinion, this match was 10 years too late. Again, a returning Hulk Hogan headlined. This time with The Rock.
Wrestlemania 19 Big Show & A-Train again, just thrown together so Taker was on the card.
Wrestlemania 20 Kane Return of the Undertaker and Deadman gimmick after being buried alive by Kane at Survivor Series.
Wrestlemania 21 Randy Ortan Legend vs. Legend Killer.
Wrestlemania 22 Mark Henry If it wasnt a casket match I dont think people would even remember the match
Wrestlemania 23 Batista Probably his first time he went against the top guy in WWE at that particular time at wrestlemania.
Wrestlemania 24 Edge again, wrestled a guy at the top of his game
Wrestlemania 25 Shawn Michaels great build up and a great match. Wrestlemania 26 Shawn Michaels this was just as good as the 1st match and well built up over the year. This was all about the streak.
Wrestlemania 27 HHH Another one that seemed to be thrown together in my opinion.
As one of the top guys in WWE, it seems strange to e why he never went against the guys in their prime at Wrestlemania. The likes of Hulk Hogan, Ultimate Warrior, The Rock, Stone Cold Steve Austin, Bret Hart, Brock Lesnar and John Cena. That's seven men who, in my opinion, should of faced Undertaker during the streak. If he faced some of these guys then it would give the streak more credibility. | |
| | | Worthy World Champion Winner At WM
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:14 pm | |
| I agree with your end comment. | |
| | | Perfect Jack Second Divorce
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:22 pm | |
| Agreed with your last comment. As much as a fan I am of The Undertaker, some of the matches were obvious results. Like against Mark Henry, the handicap match and the match against the Bossman. | |
| | | Sexton Hardcastle Heath Slater's Kid
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:38 pm | |
| can I ask, as i'm no way a wrestling historian, when they started mentioning it as a streak. Was it ever planned, or after say 5 wins which just happened anyway, they then came up with continuing the wins as a storyline. Would explain the slow start. | |
| | | hodge13 Most decorated Champion in history
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:39 pm | |
| apparantly they only noticed when it got to like 6/7-0 that he was undefeated | |
| | | Mackem Most decorated Champion in history
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Location : Sunderland, England Number of posts : 7076 Favourite Wrestler : John Cena, Stone Cold Steve Austin, CM Punk, AJ Styles & The Boogyman
| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 6:41 pm | |
| If I remember, the first mention of the streak was 10-0, after he beat Flair at WM18 and Undertaker held up all his fingers.
Agreed it was a slow start but I still think he could of went up against more over guys, even if it was later in the streak. | |
| | | Grecian Most decorated Champion in history
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 7:52 pm | |
| Okay, I openly admit to being a total Undertaker fanboy, so...
Mania 7 - Mania debut, we'll let that slide.
Mania 8 - he was being built to face the Ultimate Warrior as the stories go 9and would havce most likely lost)
Mania 9 - Gonzales was supposed to be his biggest opponent, and was brought in specifically to face Taker. had to be a mania match, and I'm glad he was kept away from Hogan and the way the event finished.
Mania 11 - HBK and Diesel was the main feud, from what I remember. Bundy still had the monster aura, so I'd count him as a worthy opponent at the time.
Mania 12 - the focus was Hart and HBK, and quite rightly taker took a back seat against another credible opponent. taker wouldn;t have been the right guy to face HBK at that time, if Vince was looking for HBK to become his main man. As much as I think Bret is over-rated and that Ironman match is stunningly painful to watch, it was the right opponent for HBK.
Mania 13 - Sid at that point was a legit monster heel, Hart and Austin was the next building block for Stone Cold.Again, at that stage, Sid was about the best of what was left. Don;t forget Shawn had lost his smile too, which shat over a lot of the booking plans for this one, so the main event was rushed together.
mania 14 - Kane. The right stage to end the feud. No other reasonable opponent.
Mania 15 - Rock and Austin were the two top guys, made sense for them to face each other. I think WWE wanted a Hell In A Cell match at mania, and Boss Man was the Corporate guy with nothing to do.
Mania 17 - Rock and Austin were the top guys. triple H was the next biggest name in WWE, again, a more than credible opponent.
Mania 18 - this is one where he could have quite easily had a much bigger opponent. Austin was buried in the mid-card with Scott Hall, having refused to work with Hogan. problem is, they'd done Taker vs Austin around 18 months earlier, and I don't think people wanted to see it again.
Mania 19 - I think by this point, Taker was working part-time, which ruled him out of the world title picture. Big show was a credible opponent, just a shite, boring match! I think it was being used to promote A-Train and Nathan Jones, but nothing really came of that idea at all.
Mania 20 - rebirth as the Dead Man, kane was a suitable opponent for this story. I don't think it would have worked as well with anyone else.
Mania 21 - Booked to promote Orton (and he was rumoured to have been offered the win, but refused). At the height of the Legend Killer gimmick, taker was the perfect opponent for orton, and again, as a part-timer, was ruled out of the world title scene.
mania 22 - I can offer no defence for this, other than the other big names on Smackdown were either in the main-eventing triple threat (Angle, Orton, Mysterio), injured (Batista) or dead (Guerrero). Mark Henry was in the middle of yet another half-arsed monster push, Angle vs Taker had been at the previous PPV (awesome match too, highly recommended)... in all honesty, Henry was pretty much all that was left.
Mania 23 - it only became a predictable result with Batista's totally half-arsed 'I'm losing so why bother?' promotion of it. Decent match though.
Mania 24 - for me, a sensational match with Edge.
Mania 25 and 26 - just... wow.
mania 27 - I didn't like this one at all, but again, a more than credible opponent.
I don't think he's been kept away from the likes of Austin, Rock, Hogan on purpose. In my opinion, he's just not been the right guy to face them at that stage. Rock vs Austin was the obvious main event, Rock vs Hogan was the dream match, HBK and Austin at the time they were being pushed shouldn't have faced Taker (Hart was the better choice to put the other guy over and make them look a million bucks doing so). When he was part-time, it would have been massively unfair to boot a guy who's on the road full-time out of a major match to squeeze in Taker, and as a part-timer he couldn't have won the title.
next year's opponent will be the interesting one - Cena would have been the obvious pick, but apparently he's kinda busy that night... | |
| | | Mackem Most decorated Champion in history
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:46 pm | |
| Reading what I wrote and reading the rest of the thread, the point I think I was trying to make wasn't so much about the title but more so of the guys he faced.
Grecian, thanks for the detailed response. I agree with most of your points but if you don't mind, i'm going to respond to a few...
Wrestlemania 8 agaisnt Jake Roberts. I didn't know they were building him up for Ultimate Warrior. This was 1992. I believe Warrior was sacked after SummerSlam 91 for wanting more money. I've heard Jake Roberts pretty much carried this story going into Wrestlemania.
Wrestlemania 13 - I would of used Vader. Yes, Vader was pretty new in WWE but I think would of been a better opponent. All the hyoe was around Bret Hart and Steve Austin so the spotlight, so to speak, wouldn't of been on Vader and Taker.
Wrestlemania 23 - this was 2007 (I think). The year Undertaker won the Royal Rumble and chose his opponent. Looking back, I think that could of been the time he faced John Cena.
These are just my views on it. They are neither right or wrong, same as everyone else's views.
Regarding next year's Wrestlemania and Undertakers opponents. Cena is busy as Grec said. With Taker being part time, no real build up will happen so i'd use Jack Swagger or Dolph Ziggler. An up-and comer.
I wouldn't use CM Punk. He'll be tied up in the title picture.
Both Wrestlemania matches against Kane were right, timing was spot on both times.
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| | | feяgie22 Heath Slater's Kid
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 8:52 pm | |
| Matt Hardy for next year, just hope Taker can botch the Tombstone. | |
| | | Rocky2 Wrestling Legend
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:24 pm | |
| Next year is interesting. I don't think they will go with an up and comer, not when Taker could finally go 20-0. It's either a HHH rematch which might not be such a certainty now that Trips is the boss, Jericho (if he's back) or Punk. A lot of people are saying Punk should be in the title picture come Mania, which I don't disagree with, but he could always defend the title against Taker. Or have Taker immediately win the title back upon his return and make Punk the challenger. | |
| | | Grecian Most decorated Champion in history
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Thu Sep 15, 2011 9:22 am | |
| And in response... - Mackem wrote:
- Wrestlemania 8 agaisnt Jake Roberts. I didn't know they were building him up for Ultimate Warrior. This was 1992. I believe Warrior was sacked after SummerSlam 91 for wanting more money. I've heard Jake Roberts pretty much carried this story going into Wrestlemania.
Wrestlemania 13 - I would of used Vader. Yes, Vader was pretty new in WWE but I think would of been a better opponent. All the hyoe was around Bret Hart and Steve Austin so the spotlight, so to speak, wouldn't of been on Vader and Taker.
Wrestlemania 23 - this was 2007 (I think). The year Undertaker won the Royal Rumble and chose his opponent. Looking back, I think that could of been the time he faced John Cena.
These are just my views on it. They are neither right or wrong, same as everyone else's views.
Regarding next year's Wrestlemania and Undertakers opponents. Cena is busy as Grec said. With Taker being part time, no real build up will happen so i'd use Jack Swagger or Dolph Ziggler. An up-and comer.
I wouldn't use CM Punk. He'll be tied up in the title picture.
Both Wrestlemania matches against Kane were right, timing was spot on both times.
Warrior and Taker had been doing a lot on house-shows together, there was the angle when Taker hit Warrior with the Urn and locked him in a casket... I think, had Warrior not been such a twat and demanded more cash, this one was being readied for Wrestlemania. At that stage with 2 PPV's between Summerslam and Mania, it would have been easy to book them both in the Rumble and have one eliminate the other to stretch it out. Mania 13 - Vader is a great shout - problem is, they'd faced each other in a singles match at the Rumble three months earlier. It would have been a recycled match, which is something WWE try to avoid at Mania. Mania 23 - this was at the height of the brand split, when Raw and Smackdown didn't ever really cross over. Cena as the poster boy and the guy WWE was really building around shoudn't have faced Taker as he'd have lost. Lashley was in the reckoning as the ECW champ too (but was already earmarked for the Battle of the Billionaires), so again, Batista was the only logical choice. I'd also think at that point, Batista was a big enough opponent that there would have been some doubt who would win, until Batista pretty much telegraphed it by being a stroppy bitch in the promotion of it. As for next year, the guy I'd go with is someone who's impressing me more and more each week - Sheamus. | |
| | | mrtc2003 NXT Champion
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| Subject: Re: Undertaker at Wrestlemania Fri Sep 16, 2011 10:21 pm | |
| Whomever they choose for next year, I think it needs to be someone well-established rather than an up-and-comer. Everyone knows that the Undertaker is going to win so he needs to go up against someone who looks like they could beat him. Sadly, the likes of Jack Swagger, Dolph Ziggler or even the Miz just don't look like credible opponants.
With regards to why the Undertaker appeared to be kept away from the big names for so long: I think, for the first few years at least, he just wasn't seen as a credible title contender or Main Eventer. His first title reign lasted only a few days and then he didn't win another title of any kind for another 6 or 7 years, Perhaps his gimmick held him back, I don't know. But I get the feeling that Vince felt that the Undertaker was best used in the mid to upper midcard feuding with the other big men. It wasn't until around 96 when he was feuding with Diesel that he started to show that was actually a great wrestler as well as having a great gimmick. | |
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